Discussion about this post

User's avatar
Leif's avatar

Strawman defeated!

I opted for "fatFIRE," retiring early from a rewarding but sometimes stressful career with millions invested and a six-figure annual spend. I don't pay close attention to the stock market, and another big drawdown wouldn't phase me. Spending well under 2% of our nest egg annually, it's more likely that we'll end up with a 9-figure net worth than zero.

In the 4+ years since I wound down my primary career, we've been able to travel all over the world for weeks and sometimes months at a time, "worldschooling" our boys while visiting amazing and historic places before they reached high school. They've seen glaciers in New Zealand, volcanoes in Hawaii, geysers in Iceland, and pyramids in Mexico. They've set foot in the Parthenon in Athens, the Pantheon in Rome, and saw the purported Holy Grail in Valencia, a city we got to know well over the course of a month. They've toured Anne Frank's house in Amsterdam, Schindler's Factory in Krakow, the Holocaust Museum in D.C. and Auschwitz / Birkenau in rural Poland.

Reaching FI and choosing RE made all of this and more possible, and my boys are now thriving in a traditional school setting.

There's so much more. My wife and I have both run our first marathons in the last two years. I took up skiing after a 30-year break, and my kids and I skied 30+ days together last season. I have a 1500+ day streak with the Duolingo language learning app, and I've got a similar streak with a daily body-weight exercise routine.

I get that FIRE isn't for everyone, and when you describe it as leanFIRE for the hopeless, it's obviously not appealing.

I don't know that I'm retired for good. I retired from medicine in 2019 and from blogging in 2023. I love the blank slate that I've got in front of me, and I'm curious to discover what I might retire from next. But in the meantime, I am forever grateful for the freedom I had to explore the world with my family while our kids were young enough to enjoy our company and old enough to appreciate the experiences we were able to give them.

For a very different take on FIRE from what you've apparently been exposed to, you can check out my writings at Physician on FIRE where I explored FI and RE during the finaly years of my physician career and the first few years after. In my projections, I used returns of 0% to 6% real, by the way, not 12% to 15%. I don't know anyone not Dave Ramsey who does this.

Cheers!

Leif

Expand full comment
Lee's avatar

I have read a lot of the MMM (and other) FIRE stuff. It's interesting, and I enjoy reading your well reasoned counterpoint JD. But I think you are missing the part about using the post-early-retirement time to do productive, life-enhancing things. The guy you're talking about, Pete, took up carpentry (for himself and as a job for clients) , started a coworking business, blogs, plays music, etc.

As the Anonymous commenter below started, whether you retire at 35 or 65 you better have something to give you purpose or you're going to spiral down the toilet, wasting your life. I think MMM has found his purpose - and writes about it - but everyone gets so caught up in the excitement of getting to the retirement finish line, they don't pay much attention to the post-retirement time.

I have done well in my career, now early 50's. I am thinking about retiring in the next 2 years - but haven't figured out a post-retirement plan yet. Until I do I won't be retiring. Is 55 'early'? Not by the FIRE standards, but I hope it's still early in my life.

I am much closer to your opinion on the materialism aspect of all this than the FIRE people - but having grown up in New England I have some deep seated thriftyness in me too. I wouldn't want to spend my retired years a) worrying about money, or b) stressing over watching the market. Part of me things the FIRE thing was born out of a low interest rate bubble. I never heard anyone talking about early retirement when mortgage rates were 8%+.

One last thought - what you do JD might be considered "retirement" by a lot of people, maybe including your former Wall Street coworkers. You created your own business, have no employees (except maybe an intern?) to worry about, live in a nice low-cost-of-living part of the country, can set your own schedule, work wherever you prefer to, etc. As a business owner with lots of employees and responsibilities, the life you've built seems like a nice way to downshift to me. :-)

Expand full comment
47 more comments...

No posts